Swhack! 20 December 2009
10:13:42 loggy (n=loggy@gimble.notabug.com) has joined #swhack
10:13:42 <pratchett.freenode.net> Topic for #swhack is: Swhack: Pure vandalism and blatant hoaxes [patent nonsense pending]
10:13:42 <pratchett.freenode.net> Users on #swhack: loggy jetscreamer xjrn BigJibby scottrageous jeffarch JibberJim sivy kpreid charl MacTed eel clsn shepazu _ulises p6eval realist tav dmiles_afk Tene nslater deltab jsled MoiraA tro Morbus tobbez CIA-7 Arnia sbp nsh procto authentic spb davisp lmorchard|away edsu l7 maxkelley Monty2 treed Jibbler Xanthor|aw jessica xxv phenny lisppaste2
10:14:09 <sbp> haha, the Egyptian calendar was divided into three seasons:
10:14:09 <sbp> Winter
10:14:09 <sbp> Summer
10:14:09 <sbp> and INUNDATION
10:14:09 <sbp> Tybi and Pharmuthi are in Winter (first and last months of Winter)
10:14:10 <sbp> and Pachon is in Summer (first month of Summer)
10:14:12 <sbp> according to http://www.ortelius.de/kalender/egypt_en.php
10:14:14 <sbp> also, kinda interesting: the Coptic calendar directly inherits from the Egyptian one
10:14:16 <sbp> so e.g. Pharmuthi became Parmoute, and then Miaziah
10:14:18 <sbp> and according to http://calendar.zoznam.sk/ethiopian_calendar-en.php today is...
10:14:20 <sbp> 11 Tahsas 2002
10:14:22 <sbp> Tahsas took over from Choiak
10:14:24 <sbp> according to http://www.ortelius.de/kalender/coptic_en.php
10:18:44 <sbp> so in 2009:
10:18:46 <sbp> 25th Pachon = Genbot = 2nd June
10:18:46 <sbp> 11th Tubi = Tarr = 19th January
10:18:46 <sbp> 15th Tubi = Tarr = 23rd January
10:18:46 <sbp> 24th Pharmuthi = Miaziah = 2nd May
10:18:46 <sbp> 25th Pharmuthi = Miaziah = 3rd May
10:18:47 <Monty2> gse
10:18:59 <sbp> though I suspect there's some kind of Julian/Gregorian thing going on here
10:20:43 <sbp> “There are those who have determined not only the year of our Lord’s
10:20:43 <sbp> birth, but also the day; and they say that it took place in the 28th year of
10:20:43 <sbp> Augustus, and in the 25th day of [the Egyptian month] Pachon [May 20 in
10:20:43 <sbp> our calendar]...And treating of His Passion, with very great accuracy, some
10:20:43 <sbp> say that it took place in the 16th year of Tiberius, on the 25th of
10:20:44 <sbp> Phamenoth [March 21]; and others on the 25th of Pharmuthi [April 21] and
10:20:46 <sbp> others say that on the 19th of Pharmuthi [April 15] the Savior suffered.
10:20:48 <sbp> Further, others say that He was born on the 24th or 25th of Pharmuthi
10:20:50 <sbp> [April 20 or 21].”
10:20:52 <sbp> — http://www.bib-arch.org/e-features/christmas.asp
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10:21:26 <sbp> so there's a 12 day discrepancy
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10:22:30 <sbp> “During this time the Julian calendar continued to diverge from the Gregorian. In 1700 the difference became 11 days; in 1800, 12; and in 1900, 13, where it will stay until 2100.” — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_calendar
10:22:34 <sbp> so it should be 13? hmm
10:23:58 <sbp> wait, doesn't that quote skip a bit?
10:24:22 * sbp consults http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf02.vi.iv.i.xxi.html
10:25:01 <sbp> yeah, heh!
10:25:02 <sbp> [[[
10:25:03 <sbp> And the followers of Basilides hold the day of his baptism as a festival, spending the night before in readings.
10:25:03 <sbp> And they say that it was the fifteenth year of Tiberius Cæsar, the fifteenth day of the month Tubi; and some that it was the eleventh of the same month.
10:25:06 <sbp> ]]]
10:25:16 <sbp> they omitted that bit in the ellipsis. "damn heretics"
10:26:44 <sbp> hmm. the fifteenth year of Tiberius was... 29 AD
10:29:23 <sbp> hmm. so I presume the "others" who use the Pharmuthi birth dates follow the practice that I saw mentioned somewhere that saints were often born and died on the same dates
10:29:53 <sbp> because we see 25th Pharmuthi given as the date of the passion
10:30:28 <sbp> so that leaves 25th Pachon as the most reasonable date
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10:31:56 <sbp> 28 Augustus is 3 BC I think
10:35:06 <sbp> as usual, this gets freaking complicated
10:35:06 <sbp> [[[
10:35:08 <sbp> Until the 16th century, 25 December coincided with 29 Koiak of the Coptic calendar. However, upon the introduction of the Gregorian calendar in 1582, 25 December shifted 10 days earlier in comparison with the Julian and Coptic calendars.
10:35:17 <sbp> urthermore, the Gregorian calendar drops 3 leap days every 400 years to closely approximate the length of a solar year. As a result, the Coptic Christmas advances a day each time the Gregorian calendar drops a leap day (years 1700, 1800, and 1900).
10:35:25 <sbp> This is the reason why Old-Calendrists (using the Julian and Coptic calendars) presently celebrate Christmas on 7 January, 13 days after the New-Calendrists (using the Gregorian calendar), who celebrate Christmas on 25 December. By 2100, the Coptic Christmas will be on the Gregorian date of 8 January.
10:35:33 <sbp> ]]] — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coptic_calendar
10:36:38 <sbp> sooOoo... 29 Koiak should be... 7th January?
10:37:04 <sbp> Koiak = Tahsas
10:37:20 <sbp> and in http://calendar.zoznam.sk/ethiopian_calendar-en.php 29th is the 7th January, yup!
10:37:44 <sbp> so I believe the source I quoted above has messed it up
10:37:56 <sbp> 25th Pachon is not 20th May
10:37:59 <sbp> it's...
10:38:18 <sbp> 13 days before 25th Pachon = Genbot = 2nd June
10:38:45 <sbp> ...which is the 20th May, nevermind. heh
10:40:47 <sbp> and anyway, really it could be either depending on what calendar system you use. I suppose the Gregorian is more accurate in terms of the solar year, but the Coptic calendar is... well actually even that doesn't really matter since they'd presumably be using the Jewish calendar
10:40:52 <sbp> so yeah, 20th May
10:44:00 <sbp> oh, I also forgot the earlier complicated bit where Clement of Alexandria writes “From the birth of Christ, therefore, to the death of Commodus are, in all, a hundred and ninety-four years, one month, thirteen days.”
10:44:09 <sbp> http://pursiful.com/2006/12/when-was-jesus-born-clement-of-alexandria/ has some summary
10:49:34 <sbp> hmm. some strange reasoning in this
10:49:45 <sbp> though I have at least seen the bit about the leap years elsewhere
10:55:59 <sbp> yeah, http://thriceholy.net/christmas.html goes through November 17th vs. January 6th in some detail. (it doesn't mention November 18th though, as the pursiful.com essay does)
10:58:34 <sbp> this article is also quite adjective inducing in places: “Da Vinci's 'Last Supper' is, to some people, the last word in spirituality: but Vasari, a contemporary observer, does not report its creator a Christian. How many people gaze in awe at Michelangelo's beautiful paintings, and think he must have seen God? How many would do so if they knew the same man also wrote homoerotic poetry?”
11:00:19 <sbp> [[[
11:00:20 <sbp> On the brothel walls there is the usual (still today, even on Facebook) bragging such as “Celadus the Thracier makes the girls moan!” - wherein the army definitely shouts the hardest (“Gaius Valerius Venustus, soldier of the 1st praetorian cohort, in the century of Rufus, screwer of women”) and “Myrtis, you do great blow jobs.” The only thing still missing is their hastily-scribbled phone numbers. Oh, and Ladies, bewar
11:00:20 <sbp> e; “Restitutus has many times deceived many girls.”
11:00:27 <sbp> ]]] — http://archaeology.tumblr.com/
11:04:14 <sbp> this essay here — http://www.themoorings.org/apologetics/chronology/Chrmas.html — does that practice of capitalising pronouns referring to Jesus
11:04:41 <sbp> I've wondered why people do this. I heard an old theory that it was supposed to mimic the original pronominal case used for deity in Greek
11:05:19 <sbp> but I see from http://stason.org/TULARC/education-books/bible-world-english/24-Why-don-t-you-capitalize-pronouns-referring-to-God.html that it might be a reflection of the KJV practice which they inherited from the general style back then of capitalising pronouns referring to kings
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11:07:23 <sbp> heh:
11:07:24 <sbp> [[[
11:07:24 <sbp> A good example of the logical mess you can get into with capitalising pronouns is John 20:15, "Thinking he was the gardener, she said, 'Sir, if you have carried him away, tell me where you have put him, and I will get him.'" (TNIV). In this verse, should one capitalise "you", as the person Mary was addressing was actually Jesus, or "him" as Mary intended this, not "you", to refer to Jesus, or both?
11:07:32 <sbp> ]]] — http://homepage.mac.com/rmansfield/thislamp/files/20060901_the_problem_with_capitalized_pronouns.html
11:08:38 <sbp> ah, http://www.themoorings.org/apologetics/chronology/Chrmas.html cites 'Kirsopp Lake, "Christmas," in Encyclopaedia of Religion and Ethics, ed. James Hastings (Edinburgh: T. & T. Clark; New York: Charles Scribner's Sons, 1910), 605.' as the source of *November 18th*
11:11:04 <sbp> ah, 6th January is 11 Tybi
11:15:00 <sbp> and 17th or 18th November are 21 or 22 Hadar
11:15:26 <sbp> which is Athyr
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11:20:48 <nslater> yo
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11:24:39 <sbp> yo
11:24:52 <sbp> reading about Basilides now
11:25:40 <sbp> I need something that converts Greek to Roman-orthography
11:26:12 <sbp> hmm. http://www.translatum.gr/converter/greeklish-converter.htm
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11:27:25 <nslater> sbp, there's a link to pompei in google streetview in the link you pasted!
11:27:41 <sbp> it doesn't seem to like some tones
11:27:49 <sbp> προδιανυκτερεύοντες ἀναγνώσεσι comes out as prodianyktereyontes ἀnagnosesi
11:28:22 <sbp> nslater: "the link"?
11:29:37 <nslater> heh
11:29:37 <nslater> http://archaeology.tumblr.com/
11:29:49 <nslater> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=pompeii,+italy+ruins&sll=40.716428,14.537315&sspn=0.061672,0.132351&ie=UTF8&hq=pompeii,+italy+ruins&hnear=&ll=40.748902,14.484834&spn=0,359.991728&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=40.748902,14.484834&panoid=1e-bu_kis-dL1BnVGZhDdw&cbp=12,209.48,,0,7.63
11:31:49 <sbp> interesting, thanks
11:32:00 <sbp> I noticed the other day that they've put the Eden Project onto maps.google.co.uk
11:32:03 <sbp> as Streetview I mean
11:32:31 <nslater> cool!
11:32:41 <nslater> you know, ive been listening to johnny cash all morning
11:32:57 <nslater> and i cant get it out of my head that he sounds exactly like hank hill from kill of the hill
11:33:00 <sbp> heh. I'm listening to ICP
11:33:03 <sbp> nslater: ahahaha
11:33:10 <nslater> icp?
11:34:17 <sbp> Insane Clown Posse
11:34:40 <nslater> hah! what
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12:01:02 * sbp checks out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_calendar#Reformed_calendar
12:01:56 <sbp> hmm, Pashons is Ⲡⲁϣⲟⲛⲥ in Coptic
12:05:55 <sbp> and Tybi became ጥር in Ge'ez
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12:47:25 <sbp> yo bjrn
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13:05:04 <Kodi> why, hello there
13:05:08 <sbp> hi Kodi
13:05:42 <Kodi> .. I'm honestly only here because I was reading bash and saw that Monty had a trivia functionality. Which I miss from an old irc channel. <.<;
13:05:43 <Monty2> Why do you tell me you were reading bash and saw that monty had a trivia functionality now ?
13:05:56 * Kodi hugs Monty2
13:05:57 <Monty2> Tuesday 22 Hadar
13:07:21 <sbp> oh, yeah
13:07:22 <sbp> I think that only works on a specific channel though
13:07:50 <Kodi> ah, thankye
13:07:55 <sbp> yeah, I don't think Monty is on the appropriate channel anymore
13:07:57 <Monty2> You kiss unreleased KDE!!!
13:08:21 <sbp> NO YUO
13:08:28 <Kodi> .. :<
13:08:29 <sbp> though, there is countdown!
13:08:29 <sbp> countdown
13:08:29 <Monty2> One large one and five small numbers: 50, 6, 3, 6, 6, 6. Your target is 844. You have thirty seconds, tick, tock, tick, tock...
13:08:39 <sbp> .c (6 * 3 * 50) - (6 * 6)
13:08:39 <phenny> (6 * 3 * 50) - (6 * 6) = 864
13:08:45 <Monty2> Duh dum, duh dum, duh-da-da-dum! Your 30 seconds are up!
13:08:46 <Monty2> Oh bugger, I don't think I can solve that one!
13:09:49 <Kodi> .. nice, though my math skills are rather.. rusty. :p
13:09:53 <Kodi> ah well ^^
13:10:03 <sbp> this is a good way to practice
13:10:20 <sbp> though this isn't really maths, it's just calculation
13:12:43 <sbp> hmm. conjunctions (BC):
13:12:44 <sbp> 14 Sept 3 Jupiter-Regulus 20’
13:12:44 <sbp> 17 Feb 2 Jupiter-Regulus 51’
13:12:44 <sbp> 8 May 2 Jupiter-Regulus 43’
13:12:54 <sbp> from http://www.newmanlib.ibri.org/NewmanPpt/StarBeth.ppt
13:13:29 <sbp> “Martin sees these three conjunctions as Jupiter (the king planet), circling Regulus (the king star), placing a crown on him.”
13:13:38 <sbp> presumably the basis for the suggestion in...
13:13:51 <sbp> the pursiful.com article
13:16:50 <sbp> some stuff at http://www.askelm.com/star/star000.htm pertaining to this
13:17:40 <sbp> funny, http://www.sonstoglory.com/starJesusbirth.htm uses "magoi"
13:17:53 <sbp> which seems a better transliteration of the Greek, but does look funny
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13:49:00 <sbp> ha
13:49:13 <sbp> I tried checking the 14 Sept 3 one in Stellarium
13:49:25 <sbp> but on that date in Stellarium they're miles apart
13:49:32 <sbp> but I found that as I progressed the days, they get closer
13:49:37 <sbp> and closer and closer until...
13:49:48 <sbp> on 14/15 Sept 2 BC, there's a conjunction!
13:49:58 <sbp> so I was wondering what's up, and then I figured a possibility
13:50:05 <sbp> scrolled up through the years, and yup!
13:50:18 <sbp> they have a year 0 in the system
13:52:09 <sbp> on the 17 Feb 2 one, it's close for a number of nights
14:00:48 <[bjoern]> Monty, bite Snow Beloving Palmer.
14:00:51 <Monty2> [bjoern] pasted "Roman Elegies, XXI, Goethe" at first class documents.
14:01:10 <[bjoern]> I privmsgd you when you were fast asleep btw, mainly to try if that works.
14:07:15 <sbp> yes, I replied to it in my very first message to you in Swhack today
14:09:18 <[bjoern]> Before your monologue which I respectfully yet wholly ignored, I see.
14:12:07 <[bjoern]> http://asset.soup.io/asset/0594/7203_34cb_480.jpeg
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14:28:50 <Monty2> yo kpreid!
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14:42:06 <sbp> how convenient
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15:22:00 <Monty2> howdy, xjrn
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15:36:38 <Monty2> hi m4rk, how ya doing?
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15:48:41 <[bjoern]> .o wa weather Magdeburg
15:48:49 <phenny> weather->Magdeburg, Germany;temperature->21 deg F (wind chill: 14 deg F), relative humidity->93% (dew point: 19 deg F), wind speed->6 mph, (59 minutes ago);, minimum: 0 deg F, 1969->average: 33 deg F, ->maximum: 53 deg F, 1989, (daily ranges, not corrected for changes in local weather station environment);name->EDVE (Braunschweig Airport), rela
15:48:54 <[bjoern]> lies
15:49:11 <[bjoern]> .weather Magdeburg
15:49:12 <phenny> EDBM: no such ICAO code, or no NOAA data
15:49:22 <[bjoern]> .weather EDVE
15:49:22 <phenny> Cloudy, -6℃, 996mb, SN Hail, Mist, Light breeze 9km/h (5kt) (↑) - EDVE, 15:50, 1450Z
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16:35:57 <[bjoern]> Monty?
16:36:00 <Monty2> wonder if expectations are true, necessarily :)
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19:38:59 <thelsdj> http://identi.ca/g0/tag/shitrude?realtime=1
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22:13:09 <[bjoern]> .u g o e
22:13:10 <phenny> U+2265 GREATER-THAN OR EQUAL TO (≥)
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22:31:25 <charl> .u l o l
22:31:26 <phenny> U+2A99 DOUBLE-LINE EQUAL TO OR LESS-THAN (⪙)
22:38:53 <[bjoern]> .u h e
22:38:53 <phenny> U+3154 HANGUL LETTER E (ㅔ)
22:38:56 <[bjoern]> .u h el
22:38:57 <phenny> U+C5D8 HANGUL SYLLABLE EL (엘)
22:39:00 <[bjoern]> .u h ell
22:39:00 <phenny> U+2026 HORIZONTAL ELLIPSIS (…)
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23:22:39 <[bjoern]> phenny, tell sbp http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/epic-fail-associated-press-fail.jpg
23:22:39 <phenny> [bjoern]: I'll pass that on when sbp is around.
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